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Something fishy in K98s

Gew88, Gew98, Kar98 etc.
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indy1919a4
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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#16 Post by indy1919a4 » Fri Feb 23, 2018 11:44 am

VMASCIOP2000 wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:22 pm

Yes, if they are not forth coming about how bad the bores are.
Oh if someone took all the time & expense to "refurb" these.. and then they are selling
them to folks that want a pristine looking rifle.. I am going to go out on a limb
and say that the barrels are going to be pretty good.. Because if you are going to "refurb"
(fake if you want) it going to be hard to sell someone the gun was mint, but the barrel was shot out..

Also if they are Russian Captures, which the evidence it there, Those bores are usually pretty
darn nice...

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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#17 Post by indy1919a4 » Fri Feb 23, 2018 11:51 am

Hey I do want to thank 72 usmc for doing alot of the detective work there and a HELL OF A NICE JOB OF SHOWING IT...I had heard some bad stuff about Classics and heard some good things.. A few times I had been tempted to purchase something from them and shoot the dice that it would be good..

When these 1st come out I did think about getting one of these

But this really stinks.. and when a man can look you in the eye (camera) & tell you its raining outside while peeing in your pocket .. Well thats enough..

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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#18 Post by sheepdawg » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:07 pm

I love that Sweaty Ben calls the Banner a prototype then says the RC serial number on the stock is a rack number. That's getting into Mitchell's territory. At least he's getting the hint that the door buster cupped butt plates go on the later K98ks this time. I wonder if any of them show up on any of the forums, that should be entertaining.
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Allt du egentligen behöver i livet är en bra kvinna, en trofast hund och en fin gammal Mauser.

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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#19 Post by retread12345678 » Sat Feb 24, 2018 4:56 pm

NO EXPERT. These were probably decent before they got a make over. They are reminiscent of Mitchells Masterpieces

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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#20 Post by VMASCIOP2000 » Sun Feb 25, 2018 10:31 am

Looking closely at the front sight bases, partially hidden but still obvious pitting. Probably not decent originally.
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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#21 Post by 72 usmc » Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:11 pm

Here is a question for the gun law experts. :think: :think: :snooty: Can an FFL knowingly sell a firearm where an altered old import mark ( generally found on the barrel & not containing a new serial number) is removed? What the heck is Classic thinking about, a search of the rifle 's number would indicate if it was imported as an import marked rifle??? Yes ? NO? Maybe its ok, since a new number is not assigned to the rifle. I wonder if the import mark is that important to them? Do the feds even care, it's a stupid tag like on a toy that says where it came from. If you switch out a barrel the mark is gone.

If I remember correct, post 2002 guns had larger import marks as a new requirement, some with new serial numbers, others without a second number.
I know no one can sell a firearm where the larger, bill board import mark containing a new second serial number ( located on the frame or receiver) and part of the mark is a new serial number if that mark is ground off. IF THAT later type of IMPORT MARK IS REMOVED it can not be sold because that is the serial number of the rifle that was removed. The the original serial number was not used in a background search. Likewise, it's a no no to have or sell a gun where the serial number is filed off or removed. But who is to know if it actually had an import mark if it is so expertly removed? Do the Feds consider import marks a joke, like a tag on a pillow or toy? Only the owner can pull off the tag or remove the import mark. I have seen Mosins where the import marks are missing (never applied on the barrel) in the crates like it never got stamped because it was done so fast, or ones that are only partially stamped. So maybe it's no big deal other than claiming there is no import mark to get extra value like a pre 1968 firearm with just ENGLAND or FRANCE stamped on them or a bring back lacking any mark. Heck, even a Mitchell Mauser with its best category still has an import mark. They do not remove them.

Classic is a little shady here, maybe on thin ice as far as honesty. They must know the barrels were turned in a lath, polished and reblued to remove an import mark. I wonder if any of those barrels had a counterbore??
Why not just say they are rebuilt by ?? and sell them like Mitchells' rebuilds. Except they are ?? rebuilds. I got no problem with rebuilt-like replicas. I find it interesting there are people that actually pay that much for one. But if you want a nice clean rifle to hang in your office...
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#22 Post by silverfox » Sun Mar 04, 2018 12:01 pm

Not an expert, but I am very skeptical. Thanks for all the research.

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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#23 Post by Hammerdown » Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:09 am

Pig dealers like classic will sell humped up rifles and rake in the profits from suckers till the end of time.....
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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#24 Post by bobvz » Sun Mar 18, 2018 8:40 pm

slowbob2 wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:26 pm
The rifles are clearly scubbed , sanded , refinished and restamped .

Yep. The stock stamps look just like the ones Numrich and SARCO sells.

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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#25 Post by 72 usmc » Mon Apr 16, 2018 1:58 am

And they have more batches :roll: A sucker is born every day :violin: :shhh: :shhh:
I added the dates and types of K98 rifles being sold by Classic over time. It is an interesting progression. I propose a new type of K98 RC has been born.

22 aug 2016 R Guns actual RCs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eEwJK116GA

23 Aug 2016 Counter bored R Guns actual RCs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-okIkNq0XY

3 April 2017 modified humped with fake slings RCs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lR5AXZT-BOI


16 Nov 2017 modified humped RCs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dw4k5rg0P4s


20 feb 2018 Modified humped RCs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... xM3T-JF1KQ


The MITCHCLASSIC has arrived :doh: :think: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
adde by edit 15 Ap 2018
An observation: in 2016 Classic was selling actual unmodified RCs with the typical RC attributes.These had an R -Guns import mark on the left side under the rear sight base- this was a very small mark. Some time in 2017 the Mitchell like modified RC's, (that I will call the "Mitchclassics"), began to show up. These are actually better than a Mitchell Mauser because all the RC traits are removed. On a "Mitchclassic" :lol: , they( we do not know who) removed quite expertly some specific attributes that Mitchell left in place- mostly all RC traits are gone . This entailed not leaving an X that Mitchell turned into an asterisk, leaving the stock a nice dark color, removing the stock's RC stamped serial number, and removing the R-Guns tiny import- other than that they have restamped numbers that match and added fake cartouches like a Mitchell, but do not have that new look like a Mitchell Mauser K98k. They ( Mitchclassic's) are perfect for a reenactor that wants a Replica K98k. They no longer have to buy a Mitchell and age the stock, deal with the deeply stamped stock serial #, and polish off the Mitchell import mark on the barrel. Who ever rebuilds these K98s has hit the right market because Classic is selling them like hot cakes.
Prices are sky high, but I think reenactors love these new replica/facsimile K98ks " Mitchclassic" rifles. No one knows who is actually doing the rebuilding.
But the work is really good. It is difficult to tell from photos where the markings have been removed. The re blue over the work matches. No grind marks appear visible. And the stock cartouches are the same as the Polish FAKE reproduction eBay stamps. I would like to actually see one of these rifles in person for an inspection.



So with all the fake slings, cleaning rods, and stamps, does anyone know who the rebuilder is that is faking these up ?????? Interestingly, I have not seen any of these show up at local gun shows. These appear to have the RC serial number and a Centerville Il import mark on the left side , but no electro written numbers and some are your typical RC counterbore. Maybe they gave up on faking and removing import marks. I will have to watch each of these closely. I think the import mark may be R-Guns on a few. These are an odd batch, some really humped some not so much???

some pic captures
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Last edited by 72 usmc on Wed Apr 18, 2018 4:16 pm, edited 8 times in total.
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#26 Post by ffuries » Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:17 am

72 usmc wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 1:58 am
And they have more batches :roll: A sucker is born every day :violin: :shhh: :shhh:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eEwJK116GA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-okIkNq0XY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dw4k5rg0P4s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lR5AXZT-BOI


So with all the fake slings, cleaning rods, and stamps, does anyone know who the rebuilder is that is faking these up ?????? Interestingly, I have not seen any of these show up at local gun shows. These appear to have the RC serial number and a Centerville Il import mark on the left side , but no electro written numbers and some are your typical RC counterbore. Maybe they gave up on faking and removing import marks. I will have to watch each of these closely. I think the import mark may be R-Guns on a few. These are an odd batch, some really humped some not so much???

some pic captures
Screen Shot 2018-04-16 at 7.52.16 AM.png
Screen Shot 2018-04-16 at 7.52.49 AM.png
Screen Shot 2018-04-16 at 7.54.40 AM.png
Screen Shot 2018-04-16 at 7.55.49 AM.png
Screen Shot 2018-04-16 at 8.00.08 AM.png
The middle picture of overhead view of the bolt shows EP numbers on the bolt.
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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#27 Post by lloydiam » Mon Apr 16, 2018 11:10 am

Just LOOKS refinished to me, when you buy from people like these folks, you buy at your own risk... If I can't handle a firearm, I will NOT buy it !................

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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#28 Post by 72 usmc » Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:39 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-okIkNq0XY

Yes, on that one batch they seem to be RCs with few to no electrowritten mumbers on the small parts and only that one seemed to still have an electro written # on the bolt. If you look at most of those batches, the RC- ness of most have been removed- few show the bolt electro written number and interestingly most now show an import mark in some of those batches. I wonder if the Feds gave them a call???
They also show the serial number stamped into the left side of the stock on a few in that one batch- most have these removed.
And get a load of the sling bull. Ben is not sure, ya right, that they are not original. :lol: :lol: Those are cheep Chinese repros and at least they could have put on some of the better quality repros like the ones sold at https://www.atthefrontshop.com/product_ ... pslngs.htm. Classic has become so much bull they need to build a barn.
Step right up folks, and get your original countered bored K98 for only $800. :roll: :doh:
Last edited by 72 usmc on Mon Apr 16, 2018 4:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#29 Post by ffuries » Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:08 pm

Hopefully forums like this one, will save some people from making the mistake of purchasing one. I would buy one for what it is, a Russian "Capture" minus all the fake stamps, at a fair market price, but that is it.
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Re: Something fishy in K98s

#30 Post by 72 usmc » Mon Apr 16, 2018 4:01 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lR5AXZT-BOI
I guess as good or better than a Mitchell-- just no mention of barrel condition. :roll: And they sell like hot cakes :shifty: :snooty: Watch out Mitchell there is a new player looking to replace you. This is beyond nuts- and I passed on an original K98k with a mismatched bolt, no papers at :shock: $1200 at the last small gun show. I guess I am the fool. :violence-smack:

Ben states "I do not have my reading glasses on".... ya that red shirt is the real red flag... therefore he can not see the fake stamps, cheep reporduction sling, and the rare strike out as well as the areas buffed that did not take the reblue job, and he definitely does not want to show the barrels or left side of the sight base where the import mark was most likely removed... but if "I had my reading glasses" I'd know what hog wash is being thrown about, but its cheep at $1400 plus :angry-soapbox: :banana-gotpics:

maybe he needs to read this: viewtopic.php?f=13&t=1911
Screen Shot 2018-04-16 at 2.43.51 PM.png
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Screen Shot 2018-04-16 at 3.05.40 PM.png
Screen Shot 2018-04-16 at 3.05.40 PM.png (71.19 KiB) Viewed 2127 times

I guess the big question is who actually has this much cash for an RC? Do people really not know what they are getting ?
To old to fight and to old to run, a Jar head will just shoot and be done with you.

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